Today is the 70th anniversary of VE day.
So … hip hip hooray … Congratulations to us for helping the Communist to conquer the world.
In honor of this 70th anniversary I cite a speech by former President Herbert Hoover warning Americans against going to war in Europe. This snippet warmed my heart because I hadn’t realized that high profile people were using this specific reasoning as a leverage to convince Americans that entry into Europe’s war, on the side of Stalin and th Soviet Union, would only guarantee the hegemony of Communist rule in much of Europe.
Former President Hoover, speaking 29 June, 1941, seeking to counterbalance FDR’s war making decision to support the Soviet Union by unfreezing Communist assets in America as well as paving the way to provide goods to Communist Russia two days following Hitler’s invasion of Russia warned,
“If we go further and join the war and we win, then we have won for Stalin the grip of Communism on Russia, the enslavement of nations, and more opportunity for it to extend in the world. We should at least cease to tell our sons that they would be giving their lives to restore democracy and freedom to the world.
Practical statesmanship leads in the same path as moral statesmanship. These two dictators — Stalin and Hitler — are in deadly combat. One of these two hideous ideologies will disappear in this fratricidal war. In any event both will be weakened.
Statesmanship demands that the United States stand aside in watchful waiting, armed to the teeth, while these men exhaust themselves.
Then the most powerful and potent nation in the world can talk to mankind with a voice that will be heard. If we get involved in this struggle we, too, will be exhausted and feeble.
To align American ideals alongside Stalin will be as great a violation of everything American as to align ourselves with Hitler.
Can the American people debauch their sense of moral values and the very essence of their freedom by even a tacit alliance with Soviet Russia? Such an alliance will bring sad retributions to our people.
If we go into this war we will aid Stalin to hold his aggression against the four little democracies. We should stop the chant about leading the world to liberalism and freedom.
Again I say, if we join this war and Stalin wins, we have aided him to impose more Communism on Europe and the world. At least we could not with such a bedfellow say to our sons that by making the supreme sacrifice, they are restoring freedom to the world. War alongside Stalin to impose freedom is more than a travesty. It is a tragedy …”
On this 70th VE day can we stop pretending that WW II was a admirable crusade? We crushed Nazism at the cost of copulating with Communism. Because of agreements reached in WW II we are responsible for the death of millions and millions of people behind a Iron Curtain that our agreements insured would fall. Because of agreements reached in WW II we had operation Keelhaul, Eisenhower’s German death camps where a million disarmed German soldiers were slowly starved to death.
Was it a good thing that Hitler was stopped?
Absolutely!!
But we should not think we defeated Hitler without selling our souls.
Amen!Amen! and Amen again!!
Dear Ironink
You seem to have missed quite an important part of WWII, America was attacked, it didn’t go looking for a war, war came looking for America….and found it!
Secondly if America had not fought in WWII, that means in Europe either the Nazi’s control Europe or even more of it falls to Communism. In Asia either Japan wins or Communism wins because Britain simply doesn’t have the power to defeat both Germany and Japan. Either way I fail to see how this makes the world a better place.
Thirdly, how logical is it to think that America killed 1,000,000 Germans after the war ended and no one noticed until the 1980’s?
The truth is that an Historian made a mistake he should not have made, confusing prisoners permanently leaving the POW camps with those who died. The figure was for all POW’s, included those who died and those who were released.
I’m very disappointed to see such an article here.
Yours Sincerely
Mark Moncrieff
Upon Hope Blog – A Traditional Conservative Future
Mark,
America was attacked by Germany?
Second, FDR DID go looking for war. Consider this read.
http://www.amazon.com/Desperate-Deception-British-Operations-1939-44/dp/1574882236/ref=asap_bc?ie=UTF8
Everything in your second paragraph is pure speculation. We could have just as easily worked to insure a checkmate by following then Mo. Sen. Harry Truman’s advice.
Democratic Senators Bennett C. Clark (Mo.) and Robert La Follette Jr. (Wi.) said similar things I can quote if you like.
Republican Sen. Robert Taft (Oh) said, “the victory of communism in the world would be far more dangerous to the US than the victory of Fascism.”
Republican US Congressman Robert E. Rich (Pn.) stated on the floor of the House,
“Those people who want us to get into this war on the side of Russia want us to get in bed with a skunk.”
Of course there were war mongers as well but it is simply the case that there were statesman speaking out against allying with the Soviets.
And this book speaks of how the US needled Japan into a position of having to strike or retreat
http://www.amazon.com/Freedom-Betrayed-Herbert-Hoovers-Aftermath/dp/0817912347/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1431139000&sr=1-1&keywords=freedom+betrayed
But briefly, on this point, we cite Pat Buchanan,
Patrick J. Buchanan, one of our more honorable historians:
. . .”But FDR did not want to cut off oil. As he told his Cabinet on July 18, an embargo meant war, for that would force oil-starved Japan to seize the oil fields of the Dutch East Indies. But a State Department lawyer named Dean Acheson drew up the sanctions in such a way as to block any Japanese purchases of U.S. oil. By the time FDR found out, in September, he could not back down.
“Tokyo was now split between a War Party and a Peace Party, with the latter in power. Prime Minister Konoye called in Ambassador Joseph Grew and secretly offered to meet FDR in Juneau or anywhere in the Pacific. According to Grew, Konoye was willing to give up Indochina and China, except a buffer region in the north to protect her from Stalin, in return for the U.S. brokering a peace with China and opening up the oil pipeline. Konoye told Grew that Emperor Hirohito knew of his initiative and was ready to give the order for Japan’s retreat.
“Fearful of a “second Munich,” America spurned the offer. Konoye fell from power and was replaced by Hideki Tojo. Still, war was not inevitable. U.S. diplomats prepared to offer Japan a “modus vivendi.” If Japan withdrew from southern Indochina, the United States would partially lift the oil embargo. But Chiang Kai-shek became “hysterical,” and his American adviser, one Owen Lattimore, intervened to abort the proposal.
“Facing a choice between death of the empire or fighting for its life, Japan decided to seize the oil fields of the Indies. And the only force capable of interfering was the U.S. fleet that FDR had conveniently moved from San Diego out to Honolulu…”
And these books refute your claims about the German death camps as set up by Eisenhower,
http://www.amazon.com/OTHER-LOSSES-Shocking-Civilians-Eisenhowers/dp/1559580992/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1431139179&sr=8-2&keywords=other+losses
http://www.amazon.com/After-Reich-Brutal-History-Occupation/dp/0465003389/ref=pd_sim_b_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=0ZCCZCSEV6W8R8N8SRAY
Seriously, you don’t think the man responsible for operation Keelhaul couldn’t also be maniacal enough to starve German POW’s to death? Please tell me you’ve heard of the Morgenthau plan.
You might want to take a look also at Patton’s private correspondence on this subject.
Thank you for the conversation.
Dear Jetbrane
“America was attacked by Germany?”
Actually yes, America had the right to protect its shipping and while doing that it was attacked by Germany. The USS Reuben James was sunk on the 31st October 1941. Which as you know was before Pearl Harbor, after Pearl Harbor, Germany declared war against the America and immediately began attacking American shipping off the eastern seaboard of the United States.
“Everything in your second paragraph is pure speculation.”
As is everything written against what I wrote. But you failed to answer my point, how would the victory of Nazi Germany and Japan have lead to a better world?
Patrick Buchanan is a true Conservative, sadly he is also one who is at all times ready to blame America first. Japan had others options than attacking America in 1941, the nightmare scenario for Britain is where they do not attack America, but only British and Dutch territories. Would America have come into the war to stop the capture of Singapore or Batavia? Maybe but I doubt it.
Japan could have taken all the oil it wanted and still not have gone to war against the United States, it did not do that however. Instead it attacked America.
I do however agree with both you and Mr. Buchanan that America made mistakes it should not have made in regards to Japan in 1941.
As for Operation Keelhaul, if you reject the idea that the French Government is responsible for Frenchmen, or that the Soviet Government is responsible for Soviet citizens, how exactly do you guarantee that British or Americans in Soviet custody are going to be returned?
Also if General Eisenhower was a monster, why didn’t the Western Allies just kill these prisoners?
The true is that we in the West didn’t want these people and the Soviets did.
Of course I have heard of the Morgenthau plan, but really it should be called the Morgenthau thoughtbubble. It was a discussion paper idea that was rightly rejected. Germany was not deindustrialized and in fact remains a highly industrial country today.
Mark Moncrieff
Upon Hope Blog – A Traditional Conservative Future
One old 1920 book that should be added to this conversation and should be read by all is “God of War” by Joseph Judson Taylor. A very insightful spiritual book.
Sorry Milton … we do not abide pacifism here.
Bret,
International politics is as far above my pay grade (and intellectual acumen) as ecclesiastical politics, but I do have a question.
You concluded your post with “Was it a good thing that Hitler was stopped? Absolutely!!”
If I may ask, why “absolutely?”
Best regards,
Wheeler
Wheeler,
Because he was a Marxist who pursued a social order where the State was God walking on the Earth.
I am no friend of either National Socialism or International Socialism. Internationalism Socialism is Jewish Talmudism. National Socialism was Hitler attempt to have the Talmud like reasoning serve Aryan interests. I’m only interested in the Talmud being overthrown.
Thank you for asking.
I trust all is well and remained honored that you visit here when you do.
Bret
Bret,
Thanks, I was just curious as to your thinking.
For me, I have no sympathies with Hitler nor those misguided souls who adore and seek to recreate the Third Reich. Likewise, I detest Communism and those who originated and continue to perpetuate it.
I’m not sure I believe it was “absolutely” a great thing that Hitler was defeated, because I have no idea how things would have developed had he defeated the Soviets. As I noted before, I don’t have the mental acumen to fully analyze and assess international politics, but I have a hard time believing that the USA really, truly had a dog in that particular fight. Just as I truly don’t care if Boko Haram (sic?) kidnaps little colored girls or not, I don’t think I would have been all torn up about Herr Hitler marching into Poland. I’ve never believed the USA has a divine mandate to be the world’s policeman. And while I know that awful crimes are being committed right now all over the world, the only ones I am absolutely sure I’m interested in are the local ones that threaten my family.
Keep up the fine work you do here. The Rushdoony/Scott item was really good, too.
Wheeler,
We agree about the part of not having a dog in the fight.
And I would be pleased as punch if the USSA would quit being the world’s criminal.
Godspeed good Sir,
Wheeler MacPherson says:
“…I don’t think I would have been all torn up about Herr Hitler marching into Poland…”
Therefore, I dont’t feel torn up about Hitler and Germany getting the kick in the ass!
You proved my point, HKW. You’re Polish, so what Hitler did was/is immediate and personal (read: familial) to you. This is right and proper and natural. Likewise, it would be perfectly natural for you to be less than passionate about, say, what the Federal government did to my people in the War for Southern Independence.