I’ve never met Rev. Joseph Spurgeon but I sure do think he is wrong a great deal. The curious thing is, I would bet the farm that the two of us agree on soteriology and perhaps even theology proper. We might even agree on eschatology. (Are you postmillennial Joe? Yet, despite all our agreements we each think the other would be better off being out of work. Now, I’m confident that Joe is a really nice guy. I’m confident that he provides superior pastoral care for the flock he serves. But katy-bar-the door is he ever wrong on any number of social issues such as what constitutes a neighbor and on the issue of the Jews. Below see some interaction between Joe and I. Keep in mind that Joe is much more popular than I am, as Joe recently pointed out. Doubtless the fact that he is more popular than I am proves that he is right.
Joe’s words are italicized. My responses are not italicized.
“When I was in the military, we had a term for someone who did stupid and boneheaded things that harmed their battle buddies: Blue Falcon. There are a whole lot of Blue Falcons in the Christian nationalist movement. Men who are trying to fight for godly civil leaders who promote the true faith are constantly dealing with flak because of Blue Falcons saying stupid stuff like, “We need a Protestant Hitler.” These foolish men have ruined any kind of movement among normal Christian people with their obsession with Jews and Nazis.”
Rev. Joseph Spurgeon
1.) I should’ve figured this clown was in the Military and still wants to admit it to the world. The US military has been the muscle for the New World Order at least since Woodrow Wilson.
2.) Honestly … what’s wrong with wanting a Protestant Hitler? A Protestant Hitler wouldn’t make the mistakes of a pagan Hitler. A Protestant Hitler would be the best of both worlds. A Protestant Hitler would get rid of the Jewish influence without putting Jews on trains and sending them to summer work camps that turned bad because supply lines were cut from bombing.
3.) As an aside did you know that it was Jewish money that accounts for the rise of the non-Protestant Hitler? Read Antony Sutton’s “Wall Street & The Rise of Hitler.”
4.) What we see here is we need to get rid of clergy like Spurgeon. (Their name is legion.) Call them “Pink turkeys.” We need to get rid of these Pink Turkeys who are completely clueless about both church history and world history.
5.) These pink Turkeys are getting in the way of Reformation in the Church. I pray imprecation every Sunday, by name, against the horde of pink Turkeys in our pulpits because they are obsessed about putting back to sleep a Church that is slowly waking up.
6.) Spurgeon serves as a classic example of “normal Christian people.” Like “normal Chrisitan people” he has been successfully propagandized into believing that Jewish influence has been the bane of Christianity for centuries. He apparently is unaware of the century long contest between Jews and Christians. He apparently is ignorant of the many Church councils over the centuries that proclaimed on this issue. It is not irrational animosity that finds people not enlisting to be “normal Christian people,” but rather it is just that some people have decided that the sin of noticing and knowing history is, in point of fact, not sinful.
“Yet subtly, the message is changing into something else. It begins to sound like one must repent of being an ethnic Jew, rather than repent of sin.”
Rev. Joseph Spurgeon
1.) I would love to see the receipts that Joe has of those in the Reformed community who are guilty of this. I, personally, have not come across it. Of course, if Joe is raising a warning about this, he needs more than a few examples. Where are the receipts Joe of this subtle change you’re noticing?
2.) Of course, it is past ridiculous for anyone to suggest that in order for an ethnic Bagel to become Christian they must repent of their ethnicity.
3.) I suspect that Spurgeon saying “it begins to sound like” is a figment of Joe’s imagination. Joe seems to think that all because he disagrees with Spangler, or McAtee, or whomever, therefore it means that those he disagrees with are guilty of wanting to read Jews out of any possibility of being redeemed by Christ.
“Of course, real Christianity does recognize Judaism as false and acknowledges that Bagels, like all people, have a sinful nature. Their rejection of the Messiah brings serious consequences. But the problem is not their ethnicity. The problem is their rejection of Christ and their sin, which is the same problem every man faces.”
Rev. Joseph Spurgeon
1.) I would suggest that Scripture may well qualify Spurgeon somewhat. Has Joe forgotten the self-Malediction oath found in Mt. 27:25?
Then answered all the people and said, “His blood be on us, and on our children!”
This was a cry that was asking that the responsibility of Christ’s crucifixion be upon every generation. Generations are traced lineally. Maybe Joe doesn’t believe self-malediction oaths make any difference? However, when we read Exodus, we see that God visits the iniquity of the Fathers to the third and fourth generation of those that hate Him.
So, while we don’t deny that all men everywhere must repent (including Jews) we recognize that sin does run generationally, per Scripture. The good news is that God has His elect among every tribe, tongue, and nation.
2.) This ethnicity thing is interesting because I viewed an interview between Todd Friel and Al Mohler yesterday where Mohler says that it is ethnicity as well as religion that will account for the fact that the Bagels are going to someday inherit all the land between the Nile and the Euphrates. Now admittedly Joe is not Al Mohler but maybe the two of them should have a conversation about the role of Jewish ethnicity as it relates to God’s dealings?
3.) It is true that rejecting Christ is the problem that every fallen man and every fallen people group faces.
“As Christianity spread, this becomes even clearer. With the passing of the old covenant system, the relative importance of Jewish opposition diminished. At one time they were a major source of persecution, but as the church expanded, new threats arose. The danger increasingly came from within the church itself, as 1 John warns. In the centuries that followed, the primary enemies were not Jews but heresies and powers such as Arianism, Gnosticism, the Roman authorities, later barbarian groups, and eventually Islam.”
Rev. Joseph Spurgeon
Allow me to submit here that Joe doesn’t know of what he speaks.
See E. Michael Jones’ “The Jewish Revolutionary Spirit.”
See Maurice Pinay’s “The Plot Against the Church.”
Even the Gnosticism in the NT was often a Judeo-Gnosticism.
Now, it is true that the Church has had many enemies throughout Church history, but a leading enemy has always been the Jews. Before WW II this was common knowledge and books were frequently written on the subject by prominent people. For example, see, Hillaire Belloc’s, “The Jews.”
“It is true that Jews were, at times, enemies of the early church. They persecuted Christians, and the Apostle Paul speaks about this. But even there, Paul also describes Gentiles acting in the same way toward believers. His point is not to single out one ethnicity, but to show that all unbelievers who reject Christ stand opposed to Him and to His people.”
Rev. Joseph Spurgeon
I Thessalonians 2:14 For ye, brethren, became followers of the churches of God which in Judaea are in Christ Jesus: for ye also have suffered like things of your own countrymen, even as they have of the Jews: 15 Who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God, and are contrary to all men: 16 Forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they might be saved, to fill up their sins alway: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.
This sure reads like the Bagels are being singled out. Peter likewise singles Bagels out when he says to the Jews … “You, by the hands of wicked men crucified the Lord of Glory.”
A fair reading of the NT does allow Spurgeon to rightly note that pagan Gentiles persecuted Christians from their own community. However, any proper reading of the NT finds it is the Jews, over and over again, indicted for their opposition to Christians. Indeed, this is why more than a few Jews want to censor the New Testament for being “anti-Semitic.”
“In recent years, there has been a new religion wearing the skin suit of Christianity. It is subtly changing some important aspects of the faith. It presents itself as conservative and faithful, yet its primary shift is in what it identifies as the central problem that must be addressed.
Historically, true Christians have understood the problem to be sin, our sinful nature found in all mankind. Because of that, the enemies of the church are the devil, the flesh, and the world. But this new movement shifts the focus. It moves from sin as the problem to making Bagels the central problem for humanity.”
Rev. Joseph Spurgeon
1.) When the Jews crucified Jesus was it not the case that the devil, the flesh, and the world, crucified Christ? Spurgeon has set up a false dichotomy where he abstracts the world, the flesh, and the devil from the concrete instantiation of the world, the flesh, and the devil animating the Bagels in their crucifixion of Jesus, the Christ.
2.) So, theoretically at least, the central problem can remain the world, the flesh, and the devil, as those animate themselves in a particular people group. Now, it is true that believers must say “no” to the world, the flesh, and the devil, and inasmuch as they don’t say “no” they are certainly responsible for giving into temptation. But that temptation, theoretically at least, could come to Christians through the delivery mechanism system called the Jews.
3.) So, Spurgeon may well be creating a false dichotomy here by separating the flesh, the world, and the devil, from the delivery mechanism by which flesh, the world, and the devil presents itself to Christians. For example, when the devil entered into Judas to deliver Christ to the Jewish Sanhedrin was not all of this a case where Jews, flesh, the world, and the devil are all mixed together in one stew?
4.) Now, obviously, many delivery systems may be used by which we fall into sin because of the world, the flesh, and the devil, but one major one as throughout church history has always been considered the Jews. I think Christians are re-awakening to this reality and this re-awakening frightens clergy like Spurgeon.
5.) So, while it is possible in some cases that there are those who are wearing the skin suit of Christianity it is also possible that Spurgeon doesn’t know his church history and fails to understand that this is no skin suit at all but a return to Tertullian, Augustine, Ignatius, and Chrysostom, etc. Would Spurgeon tell us about chaps like Luther and Calvin who were wearing skin suits when they inveighed against the Jews.
Now, lest anyone conclude that I am relying uncritically only on Roman Catholic sources I listed above (E. Michael Jones, Hillaire Belloc, Pinay) below find a book list from Non-Catholic sources. One doesn’t have to be Roman Catholic in order to commit the sin of noticing on this subject.
1) Ivor Benson, The Zionist Factor — the best starting point to get a quick, but an accurate overall view.
2) Douglas Reed, The Controversy of Zion — lengthy, but thorough.
3) Stan Rittenhouse, “For Fear of the Jews” — excellent!
4) Henry Ford, The International Jew — a much-ridiculed book, but very accurate and good!|
5) L. Fry (a pen name), Waters Flowing Eastward, The War Against the Kingship of Christ — provides an accurate account and listing of the Protocols of the learned elders of Zion; a must-read!
6) Andrew Carrington Hitchcock, The Synagogue of Satan, The Secret History of Jewish World Domination — a very important, year, by year outline of key events of the Rothschild dynasty. Quite enlightening!
7) Joseph M. Canfield, The Incredible Scofield — a must-read if you want to understand the important role of Zionism in American “Christianity!”
8) Alfred M. Lilienthal, The Zionist Connection II, What Price Peace? — Frank comments by a Jewish scholar.
9.) Devvy Kidd’s website: http://www.sweetliberty.org, an article entitled “Jewish Persecution.”
10.) The Sword of Christ – Corey Giles
11.) The Jews & Their Lies – Luther
12.) Response to questions and objections of a certain Jew – Calvin
Then there is Tertullian, Chrysostom, Augustine, etc.