If those soldiers who gave their lives for this country were still alive, whom everyone is talking about in relation to the whole flag imbroglio, they would be the first to take a knee for the National Anthem.
Do you really think they gave their lives so we could have an abortion, sell baby parts, and witness sodomites marrying one another? Do you really think they died for their country so that their descendants could be disinherited by a third world immavasion? Do you really embrace the notion that they died so the country could be overrun by crazy Marxist organizational kind of thinking?
Nope … if they hadn’t sacrificed their lives and were still alive they’d be the first one’s kneeling.
The men that fought in the American Revolution would probably turn in their graves if they saw the state of things today.
- Robert M Shivers
It seems both sides can make a case for protesting the anthem, it’s just that we are in diametrical disagreement on the motive. - Laurie VandenHeuvel
Totally disagree Bret.
Not surprised. I would bet that nearly everyone from your generation would disagree.
- Thomas Laurie VandenHeuvel
I would ask what generation has to do with anything, but I’m not asking it because I don’t want to get embroiled in this argument. - Robert M Shivers
A friend of mine’s father, Laurie, served in the Pacific (as did several of my uncles) and was present on the BB Missouri at the surrender in Sept ’45. Later in life, looking at what had was happening to America, he said it looked like they had wasted their time and effort fighting the war. I understand what he meant by that.Some nations win the battle but ultimately lose the war. In the case of the US and Britain in WWI & WWII, it looks like we won the war, but will ultimately lose the nation. It’s because the “Greatest Generation” made a golden calf of federal govt power and bowed to worship it.
And let’s not even mention that history books in 500 years, in giving one paragraph each to WW I and WW II will report something like the following,
W. W. I is to be remembered primarily because it brought Bolshevism to power in a European Nation-State while WW II will be remembered primarily because it brought that same Bolshevism to power as an international superpower. The winners of both WW I and WW II were the Bolshevists. Everyone else lost. - Robert M ShiversWWI & WWII & the Cultural Revolution in late 20th/early 21st Century America, Bret, will just be seen as the logical and inevitable fulfillment of the promise of the French & Russian Revolutions.
Yep…
Enlightenment
French Revolution
Revolution of 1848
Civil War
WW I
Jewish Bolshevik Revolution in Russia
WW II
Frankfurt School blossoms in America
Laurie, on which specific points do you disagree, and why?
- Robert M Shivers
The only other things I would enumerate Bret would be the post-war “civil rights” movement and Third World immigration to the West, which will be seen as having an impact comparable to effect on the Roman Empire of the barbarian migrations of the 5th and 6th centuries
Good and necessary additions Dr. Shivers.None of the predictions of how our history will be written years from now really matter to the point of honoring our country and our country’s heroes. Go through all the comments above–regarding past and current sins of our country and dire predictions for the future, and none of them impact our duty, right, and privilege of honoring our country and those who have given of themselves to preserve it. Does anyone REALLY THINK that I do not share in the heartache of seeing what is happening in our country? If you do, then you do not really know ME. But the point is, that I see my love for my country, much as a parent sees his/her love for a wayward child. I thank God every day that He has led all of our children and their spouses and families, to love Him and serve Him. But if there were one wayward child, I would love him or her just as intensely, and never cease to pray day and night, and work for the salvation of that child. With the same type of intensity, I love this land that God Himself has given us and prospered. I trust Him fully for the future of this country. I realize that He may be thundering judgment from heaven in His recent natural upheavals. But that doesn’t change, one wit, the blessings He has heaped upon us from our beginning. All of the naysaying spoken above doesn’t alter one iota of the fact that God has blessed each and EVERY ONE of us, including all the naysayers, through this country and its sacrificial people. Anything other than this is a refusal to acknowledge this, and a futile attempt to predict a future which only God knows.
If I had a wayward child Laurie I would anguish and pray. I would also keep the door shut in his face until he repented. I also wouldn’t honor that child in any way. It would kill me but love for God and that child would require it.
I believe that kind of response of rejection, is totally contrary to the example of the father of the prodigal son.
20 And he arose, and came to his father. But while he was yet afar off, his father saw him, and was moved with compassion, and ran, and fell on his neck, and [f]kissed him. 21 And the son said unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and in thy sight: I am no more worthy to be called thy son[g]. 22 But the father said to his [h]servants, Bring forth quickly the best robe, and put it on him; and put a ring on his hand, and shoes on his feet:
Only when the son returns does the Father embrace. Until such a time the son was without honor or standing.
It is love for God and my kinsmen that finds me refusing to stand for the Pledge or for the anthem.
- Thomas Laurie VandenHeuvel
-
- Thomas Laurie VandenHeuvel
“But while he (the son) was yet afar off…” shows a father yearning for his son. Case closed from my end.
Did I say anything about not yearning?
I say the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience bearing witness with me in the Holy Spirit, 2 that I have great sorrow and unceasing pain in my heart. 3 For I could [a]wish that I myself were anathema from Christ for my brethren’s sake, my kinsmen according to the flesh:
- Adele LaVeau
I sincerely thank you Laurie for answering with an obvious passion about the subject. But I also believe you have no understanding of the comments above. As a former Marine, you would refer to me as a hero. That would be idolatry. My service as a Marine did absolutely NOTHING to perpetuate liberty or freedom. My service only helped to further enrich the satanic bankers who have destroyed this country, casting everyone into slavery and tyranny. If you believe American troops are protecting your freedom fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan, you must ask yourself how Iraq and Afghanistan ever took possession of your freedoms, necessitating intervention to liberate them.
I refuse to stand for a flag that honors every evil thing permitted in this country. I refuse to stand and grant honor to a flag that represents the spread of global tyranny, and I refuse to stand for a flag that has been waging war against my countrymen and kinsmen since 1861.
- Jack Burhenne
The enemies were not all internal Adele. The commie threat was real and needed to be opposed. I did my time in the military during the Vietnam era, and it’s clear that service in the military can involve tremendous sacrifice, whether or not that sacrifice is twisted by evil men in an evil society. That sacrifice ought to be recognized and respected, and your blanket condemnation of the motivations of those involved is arrogant.Then call Maj. General Smedley Butler arrogant. He was a two time Congressional Medal of honor winner. In his book. “War is a Racket” he takes much the same tack as Adele LaVeau.
Short book … you should give a read
- Adele LaVeau
You might have a valid point Jack, had the American Imperial forces actually ever fought to defeat Communism. Instead, going back to America’s first Marxist president, Abraham Lincoln, America has fought on the side of Communism, and has all but ensured Communism’s global victory. I’ll take arrogance over ignorance every time. I would recommend Anthony Sutton’s “The Rise and Fall” triology of books to sustain my observations here. - Jack Burhenne
You mean those Russian subs we were playing cat & mouse with Adele in the North Sea were a figment of my imagination? Or that Uncle Ho wasn’t determined to turn all of Southeast Asia into a commie hell hole? You’re the one who’s ignorant and blind to boot. - Adele LaVeau
Typical of one who serves in a low-level position and believes involvement in a few tactical exercises equals mastery of the strategies of those holding all the pieces on the board.
- Jack BurhenneYou cannot deny, Adele, that the “American imperial forces” had a horribly bloody confrontation with the commies in southeast Asia and that those Vietnamese commies were supplied by the Russian & Chinese commies. No matter who you think was pulling the strings, we actually DID engage the communists. Period.
- Adele LaVeau
I like you, but you don’t make it easy. Considering there would have been no global communism without American finances, and both world wars were fought to usher in communism on a global scale, it matters not that Americans engaged their teammates. Of course, my nation was involved in a brutal war against communist forces flying the U.S. flag. Lincoln’s Yankee commies were every bit as Marxist as those of Lenin, Stalin, Mao, and Pol Pot. Just further proof that America has never fought against communism, but merely engaged fellow communists. - Jack Burhenne
– I’ve been watching the Ken Burns Vietnam documentary the last several daysAdele, and there is no doubt in my mind that those poor bastards were fighting evil men operating under a terribly brutal communist ideology, and no matter what this country’s faults are, I’d rather live under our system than theirs. And, there is also no doubt in my mind that a significant number of those men, in their minds and hearts, WERE fighting to keep this country free from the global communist threat, and they were heroic and it is a crime of ingratitude to denigrate their terrible sacrifices just because they don’t line up with your rigid ideology. - Adele LaVeau
You don’t pay attention very well Jack. It is a lie to accuse me of ‘denigrating’ the sacrifices made by those who thought they were fighting for liberty. I thought the same thing. But for you to be consistent, you would have to honor the sacrifices made by the warriors of every nation fighting for what they are told is their own liberty. And you would especially have to honor those noble peasants and farmers in Dixie who fought, suffered, and died protecting their Christian homeland from communist American Yankee invaders. And while on that subject, I think you’ve identified your problem for us: Ken Burns. - Jack Burhenne
I fully stand with the people of the South and their fight against the Federal monster Adele. As for Ken Burns, as much as he tried to spin the Vietnam documentary, enough truth slipped by to convince me that if we’d had rolled over and played dead for the commies in Vietnam, it wouldn’t have improved our situation today at all. - Adele LaVeau
I’m delighted Jack, to see that you understand Ken Burns’ federal slant. But again, you’re missing the point. It matters not how evil the communist foes were. We did nothing to ensure liberty here at home by fighting them in their backyard. Again, there would never have been a communist faction in SE Asia, had not Wall Street banksters financed the Bolshevik coup. Had we engaged Stalin in Europe, instead of allying with him, we could have forever diminished the threat of the spread of communism. It is in that spirit that you must understand that NOTHING our military has done has helped to stop the global spread of communism. On the contrary, the American military has been fighting for corporate and financial interests for a long time.I mourn the needless death and maiming suffered by our fighting forces in the false name of liberty. I blame not the brainwashed minions who are merely acting in accordance with the Huxleyian programming with which they have been inculcated since before birth. However, their sacrifices are just that: sacrifices on the altar of Molech, to ensure that the bloodlust of the foreign gods of Talmudic communism is perpetually satiated.
- Thomas Laurie VandenHeuvel
I wish I knew Adele LaVeau. She and I would get along famously.