A Discussion Concerning Warren’s Prayer

Eva Marie Cropsey — Daughter of a Michigan State Senator

“Isa” is the name for Jesus in Arabic. Yeah, it’s the name used in the Qu’ran, because the Qu’ran was written in Arabic. You can’t look at this and say it’s “totally disgusting, since all those mentioned are not the same God at all,” because they are all actually referring to the same person. Yeah, Islam goes wrong in what they believe about Jesus’ resurrection and in believing that Muhammad was greater than He was, but they do honor and revere Him.

Unless you actually talk to Rick Warren, you can’t give his motivation for praying the way he did. However, a possible alternative to the idea that he’s just trying to make everybody happy is that he’s trying to build on the common roots of Christianity, Islam, and Judaism. If you know anything about the history of these religions, you should know that Christianity’s basis is in Judaism (Jesus is the fulfillment of the prophecies in the Hebrew scriptures), and Muhammad was greatly influenced by both Judaism and Christianity. If you want to reach people for Christ, you need to build on common ground, rather than trying to eliminate the commonalities you do share. Jesus called us to be peacemakers (Matthew 5), and Paul sets a precedent for this in his sermon to the Areopagus (Acts 15) where he quotes the an Athenian poet and references an Athenian religious tradition of worshiping an unknown God (for more on this, you should read Eternity in Their Hearts by Don Richardson). The Shema is from the Hebrew Scriptures, yes, but aren’t the Hebrew Scriptures also your Old Testament? God hasn’t changed since then. Islam teaches that God is compassionate and merciful, but doesn’t Christianity teach the same? And in case you’re wondering, “Allah” is simply a generic word that means “God.” There are thousands of Christians in the Middle East that use this word to refer to the same God that you and I worship.

I’m sorry. It looks like neither one of us is going to change our positions, so there isn’t any reason to discuss it further. I would suggest that you research the historical roots of both Islam and Christianity for yourself–outside of what you have been taught by a pastor or Christian educator–and also that you read the book A Deadly Misunderstanding by Mark Siljander.

Bret responds,

No, you are wrong. If Jews and Muslims do not believe Jesus is the Son of God who died for the sins of the world they do not revere him and they do not honor him. In point of fact they dishonor him, disrespect him and call God a liar. That is not revering! In point of fact that is blasphemy.

This can be seen by your notion that Islam, Christianity and Judaism has common roots. What Islam and Judaism teach is diametrically opposed to Christianity. Judaism and Islam are bastard religions that deny the essence of Christianity. The Triune God that Christians serve has absolutely nothing in common with the Unitarian blasphemy of Islam and Judaism. Muslims and Jews deny the virgin birth. Muslims and Jews deny that there is salvation in no other name except for Jesus. Muslim and Jews deny that Jesus is God. Muslim and Jews deny that Jesus will return again to judge the quick and the dead. Saying that Islam, Christianity and Judaism have common roots is like saying that a Porn Flick, a Snuff Movie and “Old Yeller” have common roots all because they are all cinema.

When a minister of the Gospel of Jesus Christ prays he is not looking to find common ground with pagan religions or pagan gods. In doing so he is doing exactly what I suggested he was doing when I wrote the analysis piece of Warren’s prayer. When a Christian minister prays he prays that the God of the Bible would defeat all other rival gods and deliver their adherents out of the false religions they are in bondage to.

No you advised me that my learning is deficient. I should probably tell you that I am a Pastor. I have the requisite degrees. I have done the research. I have already read the books you recommend.

Allow me to suggest you have read all the books that are creating the current crisis in Christianity. For example in Acts 17 Paul was not using a common ground approach. You might want to check out this links to see that discussed in detail.

http://www.cmfnow.com/articles/pa045.htm

Common ground evangelism is a disaster precisely because the pagan denies the common ground exists. He hates God and so hates the common ground you are trying to reach him on. If you are interested in seeing this idea teased out I would recommend,

http://www.the-highway.com/defense_VanTil.html

The OT is my Bible but it is not the Jewish Bible. They read it in such a way that it is no longer the Scripture to them. They twist it and ruin it and what Jews need to be called back to is the Scriptures they deny by the way they read it.

Allah may be the same word for God but He is not the same God. We do Islam no service by allowing them to think Allah and the God of the Bible are the same beings. Primarily because the God of the Bible exists and Allah doesn’t. I don’t care if converted Muslims use the word Allah to address God as long as they are convinced of Allah’s Triune character.

Siljander used to be my congressman years ago. He is a liberal and knows less about Islam then I’d care to mention. A good beginning resource on Islam is Serdga Trifkovic. He grew up around Islam and knows what a danger it is and how it hates Christianity, and how it will not be satisfied until it conquerors all its competitors.

Rick Warren is a well intended fool who is trying to sink Christianity into a sea of meaninglessness pluralism. I’m afraid you’re already wearing the weights around your ankles. You strike me as a sharp young lady. If you are as sharp as you sound you will go the extra mile and investigate these things I’m telling you to see whether or not they are so.

Author: jetbrane

I am a Pastor of a small Church in Mid-Michigan who delights in my family, my congregation and my calling. I am postmillennial in my eschatology. Paedo-Calvinist Covenantal in my Christianity Reformed in my Soteriology Presuppositional in my apologetics Familialist in my family theology Agrarian in my regional community social order belief Christianity creates culture and so Christendom in my national social order belief Mythic-Poetic / Grammatical Historical in my Hermeneutic Pre-modern, Medieval, & Feudal before Enlightenment, modernity, & postmodern Reconstructionist / Theonomic in my Worldview One part paleo-conservative / one part micro Libertarian in my politics Systematic and Biblical theology need one another but Systematics has pride of place Some of my favorite authors, Augustine, Turretin, Calvin, Tolkien, Chesterton, Nock, Tozer, Dabney, Bavinck, Wodehouse, Rushdoony, Bahnsen, Schaeffer, C. Van Til, H. Van Til, G. H. Clark, C. Dawson, H. Berman, R. Nash, C. G. Singer, R. Kipling, G. North, J. Edwards, S. Foote, F. Hayek, O. Guiness, J. Witte, M. Rothbard, Clyde Wilson, Mencken, Lasch, Postman, Gatto, T. Boston, Thomas Brooks, Terry Brooks, C. Hodge, J. Calhoun, Llyod-Jones, T. Sowell, A. McClaren, M. Muggeridge, C. F. H. Henry, F. Swarz, M. Henry, G. Marten, P. Schaff, T. S. Elliott, K. Van Hoozer, K. Gentry, etc. My passion is to write in such a way that the Lord Christ might be pleased. It is my hope that people will be challenged to reconsider what are considered the givens of the current culture. Your biggest help to me dear reader will be to often remind me that God is Sovereign and that all that is, is because it pleases him. View all posts by jetbrane